Archive for the ‘punishment’ Category

      Divine love, justice, and condemnation are topics, today; and there is more on making church attendance mandatory. The “Yahoo! Answers” writer using ID “Ruan” (Level 1 with 61 points, a member since December 20, 2012) posted the following:

If God is a God of love, why does he send people to hell?

Really been thinking ’bout this!

THE BATTLE AXE: Church Mandatory? (05/06/2013)—(5.) Commitment, conviction and cooperation that are vital to full participation within a faith-based community must be the starting point and not the end goal for acknowledgment, service and worship of GOD. The device of mandatory school attendance for academic instruction and human socialization is usually imposed upon minors only, and those lacking experience and mature perspective for assessment of their life needs. Public schools are seen justified and legitimate in the light of shared personal goals, collective needs, and communal standards that are generated both outside of as well as within a municipality. By contrast, church schools function as instruments of GOD generating direction, form and structure for spirit content from Divine Person. Awareness of the direct operation, presence, and expressed will of GOD are to be increasingly acknowledged, and discerned through discovery and growth. Demands that are carnal, material and social must be made secondary and suppressed, for more than a simple transfer of data and information must occur. The believer must continue to acquire divine content through practice that provides increasing certainty and sacred person.

THE GOLDEN ARROW: And God spake all these words, saying, I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments. Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain. (Exodus 20: 1-7, King James Version)

THE DOUBLE DAGGER: How To Love GOD (03/24/2013); A Second Adam? (03/25/2013); The Love of GOD (03/03/2013); Our Need for a Son (03/04/2013); Wanting To Have Our Way (03/09/2013); Not Even Sorry? (03/10/2013); Love in Christ (10/23/2012); Escape from Racism (10/24/2012); Justice Comes by Love? (10/01/2012); A Daily Revelation? (10/02/2012)

      Ruan, most mature Christian believers have also thought about how teachings about the love of GOD appear to contradict those about divine condemnation, and the need for righteous judgment. Here are some points that also should come into view:

(1.) In general, human love describes a balanced relationship between two persons having equality and legitimacy as peers, or among a group of persons sharing in unspoken agreement and social consensus (e.g., families, neighbors, tribes). Everyone does not love GOD; and all are not in a relationship of love to the Creator.

(2.) Accountability and duty within relationships for the Divine Person is greater than that demanded for created beings and living creatures. As the senior, eternal, indestructible, stronger and wiser, GOD must complete tasks, generate standards for truth, maintain ongoing process, manage recurring responsibilities, and provide constant guidance.

(3.) Correctly expressed, experienced and understood, love does not encourage, endorse, or multiply wrong-doing. In godly judgment, love appears as admonition, correction, forbearance, forgiveness, law, mercy, and punishment. It is love that the consequences for violation of the law (called “sanctions”) are published before any offense is committed, and choice is extended to all. It is love that punishment (i.e., clear action to establish awareness that relationship and trust are violated) is often meted without a total destruction of relationship.
    
     There is far more to be said, correctly applied, and spiritually apprehended. (For example, (4.) It is the amazing grace and love from GOD through Jesus Christ that transform the abstract relationship between the Creator and mankind into working relationships as apostles, priests, prophets, kings and those who spread the Gospel and that also establish adoption and intimate relationship to divinity as children of GOD. The “broken” relationship that describes one as a sinner cannot be restored apart from Christ, and requires repentance provided only through the Holy Spirit. Where the remedies of Christ are refused, there must be the irreversible elimination of the sinner and of all sin in order to preserve and protect those loved by the Creator throughout the universe of GOD.) Even so, I trust this fragment will be useful. Be it unto you according to your faith.

THE BLACK PHOENIX
Washington, DC

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      Topics, today, include preaching the Gospel and how to accept Bible truth. By the end of April 2013, I will be displaying more than 625 categorized and tagged daily blog articles posted at eternalphnx.wordpress.com . The “Yahoo! Answers” writer using ID “Steven” (Level 1 with 107 points, a member since April 16, 2013) posted the following:

Why do Christians fail to preach the gospel?

Church is not for you it is for the lost yet it says become a place for Christians to gather and forget to find others.

THE BATTLE AXE: How To Accept Bible Truth (04/17/2013)—Accepting the divine truths of destruction and perdition for the wicked is inseparable from embracing the Gospel and good news of mankind’s salvation through Jesus Christ. (One can not “separate the wet from the water,” so to speak.) In addition to faith, believers must receive balance, “divine distance” (we say, detachment or perspective), longsuffering, wisdom and wrath against sin, that establish neutrality, objectivity and zeal in judgment. All “feelings” of being bullied or victimized by GOD are completely replaced by realization of the great weight upon GOD as sovereign above a universe under threat by sin. The imperfect, self-interested, short-lived and temporary solutions to sin that have been proposed by created beings and living creatures are immediately understood as improper, inadequate and unacceptable.

THE GOLDEN ARROW: For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent. Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God. Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called: But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: That no flesh should glory in his presence. (1st Corinthians 1: 18-29, KJV)

THE DOUBLE DAGGER: My Sheep Hear My Voice (03/08/2013); Wanting To Have Our Way (03/09/2013); Hellfire and Brimstone Preaching (12/27/2012); The Dove (12/28/2012); The Focus of Judgment (12/09/2012); His Burden is Light? (12/10/2012); The Gospel not Logical? (09/16/2012); Unwelcome Gifts? (09/17/2012); On The Messiah (02/19/2012); All Know Gospel? (03/20/2011); Limit to Sin? (03/21/2011); Dispatch 44: Just A Closer Walk (09/23/2011)
    
     Steven, here are some points that may be new to you that come from an older Christian’s point of view:

(1.) All believers are not spiritually endowed or equipped to preach. The many needs of the spirit body (we say, church and congregation) demand a variety of gifts through the imparted, indwelling Spirit of Jesus. Included are consolation, giving, government, healing, hospitality, miracles, prophecy and teaching.

(2.) All Christian believers are “born again” from divine substance (sacred DNA, so to speak); however, all are not yet mature and perfected. Once “born again” there are challenges to be met and “growing pains.” There must be continuous life experience, growth and acquisition of sacred knowledge. For this reason, forbearance, longsuffering, patience, mutual respect and sharing are practiced as vital within every congregation under the Headship of Jesus.

(3.) Rightly understood, the “foolishness of preaching” is more than a verbal presentation on religious subjects. It is an operation of the Spirit of GOD wherein the divine agent determines both what is uttered, and how utterance is received as spiritual awareness within the hearers. The human actors (both preacher and listener) must submit as an instrument of the Spirit having no personal agenda and private objectives.

      There is far more to be said, correctly applied, and spiritually apprehended. (For example, (4.) the Gospel of Jesus Christ is more to be shared as a non-verbal display of holy living (we say a practice of sacraments) than as a speech in a public forum. Christ is to appear active and alive upon the earth through the commitment, dutifulness, faith, flesh and bone, reverence, service and worship of every believer.) Even so, I trust this fragment will be useful. Be it unto you according to your faith.

THE BLACK PHOENIX
Washington, DC

Accepting biblical truth is the topic, today, and there is more on why GOD is concerned for humankind. The “Yahoo! Answers“ writer using ID “?” (Level 3 with 2,140 points, a member since August 17, 2012) posted the following:


How am I supposed to accept this in the Bible?

The Bible says that God eternally punishes those who do not believe him.*
Some will say, “no, it’s the devil punishing, not God. “

However, that is untrue.

In Revelations, it clearly states that God will destroy Hell.**

Yet, even after he destroys Hell, he just throws it and everyone in it into another place called the Lake of Fire.***

When I first heard this, I thought that maybe the Lake of Fire was like a place where it destroys your soul, because it’s the “second death,” therefor, you would be at peace and not in torment anymore.
But if you actually read the whole chapter, the Lake of Fire is no different from Hell. It is, again, a place of eternal torment and punishment.****

 

I cannot understand how God, not Satan, because God has also destroyed Satan at this point, would willingly punish people eternally simply for not believing in him.
That’s just screwed up I can find no excuse for it.
 
* = “And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.” – Matthew 25:46

** = “And death and hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.” – Revelations 20:14

*** = “And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.” – revelations 20:15

**** = “And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.” – Revelation 20:10

Additional Details

>”truly Hell is too good for those who have done such an abomination and possess such attitudes that you are expressing.”

So saying that we should not eternally torture people who may have never even heard the gospel in the first place and may have lived really good lives is an “abomination”?
wat?


THE BATTLE AXE: Why Would GOD Worry About Us? (04/16/2013)—(5.) Mankind remains an aspect of full divine person, and will never be completely cast away and rejected by GOD. The imparted, indwelling Spirit from GOD imparts life, person, and other aspects of being. This is also demonstrated through the appearance of GOD in human flesh as Jesus of Nazareth. See Luke 24: 36-48, Acts 1: 6-11 and Ephesians 5: 30, KJV. (6.) Despite the ministry of GOD upon the earth and from the heavens, mankind continues to be unpredictable and unresponsive to the concessions, and provisions for reconciliation. Many continue to scorn divine provisions, including compassion, forgiveness, longsuffering and mercy. See again Deuteronomy 31: 24-29, 2nd Chronicles 24: 17-20, Isaiah 48: 1-11, Zechariah 7: 8-14 and Acts 7: 51, KJV.


THE GOLDEN ARROW: Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country: And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it. And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another. Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise. But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son. But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance. And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him. When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen? They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons. Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord’s doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes? Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof. And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder. (Matthew 21: 33-44, King James Version)


THE DOUBLE DAGGER: A Guide to Salvation? (04/10/2013); Faith, Language and “Mystery” (04/11/2013); GOD Knows Tomorrow (04/12/2013); What to Take Literally (03/11/2013); My Sheep Hear My Voice (03/08/2013); Wanting To Have Our Way (03/09/2013); Understanding Hell (01/09/2013); The Golden Age? (01/10/2013); The “Lake of Mercy” (11/03/2012); Seeking and Being Sought (11/04/2012)


You (and all other created beings and living creatures) are supposed to accept it as a demonstration of the righteousness of GOD, by putting away your exaggerated ideas of your own importance, and acknowledging the Divine Person with humility and respect. You must challenge your apparent assumption that there is innocence for all others (like your own), such that none are now, or ever will be, deserving of severe punishment and termination of their existence. Although you may be a man of peace, had you, today, an enemy repeatedly attacking your family and home behind your back, contrary to all law enforcement efforts, deceiving, lying, violating every agreement from meetings to reason together, etc., etc., etc. you might well seek to save the lives of loved ones by trying to physically end all threat, and “removing the possibility for further dispute.”

It is the work of sin to deny, destroy and undo divine law, the integrity of created beings and living creatures, and the existence of Divine Person. Thus, it is also the work of the Creator to eliminate sin, recover all that have been tainted by sin, and establish the truth that sin will never rise again within the universe of GOD. Sacred operations on a divine scale must come into view. Included are birth, death, Incarnation, impartial yet thorough judgment, rebirth, repentance, resurrection, and sanctification.

There is far more to be said, correctly applied, and spiritually apprehended. (For example, through the ministry of Jesus Christ, believers are granted a “divine point of view,” so to speak, with insights regarding sacred purposes. The Scriptures function the same way, granting believers sacred insights from thousands of human lives over the course of thousands of human events. Accepting GOD’s view becomes much easier once “born again” from divine DNA, that is, after having received his Holy Spirit. Ones anger on behalf of mankind, and their voice as spokesperson, prophet, and Champion of Compassion for humanity then takes on its correct weight, and eternal value.) Even so, I trust this fragment will be useful. Be it unto you according to your faith.


THE BLACK PHOENIX
Washington, DC

      Response is shared with a writer who is angry that refusing divine gifts will be punished by hell fire, and more on the complaint that teachings about sin from the Gospel of Jesus Christ are not “logical”. A “Yahoo! Answers” writer using the ID “Kagos” (Level 2 with 601 points, a member since May 19, 2012) posted the following:

Doesn’t God punishing people for politely declining his blessings defeat the point of them being gifts?

“You’re going to be happy and have an amazing life AND YOU’RE GOING TO LIKE IT!. Don’t you ******* dare tell me you don’t want what I have to give you, or that you could make yourself an even better life than what I have planned. Everyone else who did that is now burning in a pit of flame in which they can never have the merciful death for which they beg. Now just accept my free, no strings attached gifts and give me your soul in return.”
I’m sorry, but that just doesn’t sound like anything a loving father would do. :S


THE BATTLE AXE: The Gospel not Logical? (09/16/2012)—The aspects of human experience that dominate our thinking and understanding are primarily appetite (such as hunger, thirst, sexual cravings), sensation (such as hearing, smelling, seeing, tasting), and desire (such operations of mind as fantasy, imagination, projection, recall). Our human awareness and consciousness must be changed to recognize things that are totally spiritual in their nature and substance. GOD must establish a complete reconfiguration of our inner being, and so we say, a person must be “born again.” This is not accomplished by human intellect and thought. In fact, it is spoken of as “non-sense”; and proceeds within us by the person of GOD being present as imparted, indwelling spirit. In its simplest statement, the Gospel declares the release of mankind from sin as a continuing aspect of human existence through the death and resurrection of GOD incarnate (i.e., in the flesh as a human). This rebirth requires spirit substance that itself makes up the Divine Being (e.g., faith, holiness, righteousness, truth, wisdom, wrath against sin). We speak of the Holy Spirit (also called the Comforter, the Spirit of Truth, the Spirit of Prophecy) as having been given to mankind to acknowledge and confirm the work of Jesus in the earth, on behalf of both GOD and man. This peculiar aspect from the full person of GOD, the Holy Spirit, now operates upon and within those who seek right relationship with GOD through Jesus Christ.

THE GOLDEN ARROW: And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you. For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent? Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion? If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him? (Luke 11: 9-13, King James Version)

THE DOUBLE DAGGER: By Grace (09/04/2012); About Conversion (09/03/2012); Girdle 44: The Good Seed (12/31/2011); Girdle 40: The Clift In The Rock (12/27/2011); Girdle 1: Be Ready (11/16/2011); About Promises (02/16/2011); Turn From Sin? (02/15/2011)

      
     Because you are thinking “after the flesh” instead of “after the spirit,” it is difficult (and apparently painful) for you to grasp the sacred meaning, and process of GOD. You are still using ideas from carnal, material and social reality to speak about things that are entirely spiritual in their nature and substance. Once you achieve the emotional and mental control that is part of being born again, and “growing up again” to become spiritually mature, you will see that the language of “gifts from GOD” is merely a device to assist those who are underdeveloped, and immature. GOD must commune with men at their level as created beings and living creatures. To speak of “gifts” is only useful to begin ones spiritual learning in the same way “mama” and “dada” are used, and with growth are discarded. Similarly, memorizing ABCs is a great achievement for a small child, yet one still cannot read and write until they learn to combine and recombine letters of the alphabet.

      Your anger, condemnation, distrust, fear, frustration, and pain are not from GOD–they are aspects of your expression as someone caught in the human predicament. As a result, you do not appear to have the Holy Spirit from GOD that is necessary to convince you of this. Where you truly want to achieve a correct relationship with GOD as your Creator, your Savior, your Father, you will have to approach him in prayer showing humility and respect. You will have to ask for his guidance, even claiming all the benefit from the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus.

      There is far more to be said, correctly applied, and spiritually apprehended. (For example, “death,” “joy” “punishment” and “eternal life” are terms that have special meaning to mature believers that is hidden from those who are beginners. As men on the earth, in human communication, we are forced to use “bananas for watermelons,” so to speak. Putting aside all differences (size, shape, weight), the two are exactly the same: both are green (at first), both are fruit, both have exactly the same function of bearing seed. Similarly, putting the flesh aside, we use breath, utterance and words to convey divine spirit.) Even so, I trust this fragment will be useful. Be it unto you according to your faith.

THE BLACK PHOENIX
Washington, DC